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Post by Rubislaw32 on Feb 2, 2016 4:24:46 GMT -8
On June 26th 1970,The San Francisco Chronicle received a letter from Zodiac.After his now customary introduction,the message commenced as follows :
'' I have become very upset with the people of San Fran Bay Area.They have not complied with my wishes....''
These words have become the starting point for debate,as to whether Zodiac was a local man - or perhaps,originated from somewhere else [?].There is a sense that Zodiac viewed himself as separate from the good folk of the San Francisco vicinity.He referred to these ''people of San Fran Bay Area'' as dwellers of a specifically named bay - one which locals ordinarily,would only ever have referred,themselves,as ''The Bay'' or ''Bay Area''.Perhaps to Zodiac,he was distinguishing it from another bay,more familiar to him [?].
Ricardo has opened a thread on this website called ''The Red Phantom''.In it he infers the possibility that Zodiac,using an alternative name,The Red Phantom,may have written to Count Marco,well before the infamous ''Count Marco letter threat''.If true,then it is likely that Zodiac was a resident of Chicago,at that time.
Expressions employed by Zodiac,in his letters,such as ''fiddle and fart'',indicate that Zodiac may have originated from The Southern States - and Texas,in particular.
A possible derivation of Zodiac's adopted introduction : ''This is the Zodiac speaking'',has been suggested as emanating from the BBC's World Radio Service,whose hourly news bulletins always started as follows : ''This is the World Service of the BBC,from London - here is the news,with [newsreader's name] speaking.'' Perhaps Zodiac was an ex-patriot worker [?].A military man or merchant seaman [?].An engineer in the Oil or Construction Industry [?].
A substantial list of inferences and references indicates that Zodiac was an Anglophile.But was he a San Franciscan Anglophile ?Perhaps Zodiac was actually a Briton - and even,more specifically,an Englishman [?].
The whole expression of the phenomenon of Zodiac,represents an abomination.Did this abomination rise from the ''San Fran Bay Area'' ? - or was its seed cultivated in a foreign field,with a ''whirlwind'' harvested on San Francisco's soil [?].
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Post by Ricardo on Feb 3, 2016 0:41:00 GMT -8
On June 26th 1970,The San Francisco Chronicle received a letter from Zodiac.After his now customary introduction,the message commenced as follows : '' I have become very upset with the people of San Fran Bay Area.They have not complied with my wishes....'' These words have become the starting point for debate,as to whether Zodiac was a local man - or perhaps,originated from somewhere else [?].There is a sense that Zodiac viewed himself as separate from the good folk of the San Francisco vicinity.He referred to these ''people of San Fran Bay Area'' as dwellers of a specifically named bay - one which locals ordinarily,would only ever have referred,themselves,as ''The Bay'' or ''Bay Area''.Perhaps to Zodiac,he was distinguishing it from another bay,more familiar to him [?]. Ricardo has opened a thread on this website called ''The Red Phantom''.In it he infers the possibility that Zodiac,using an alternative name,The Red Phantom,may have written to Count Marco,well before the infamous ''Count Marco letter threat''.If true,then it is likely that Zodiac was a resident of Chicago,at that time. Expressions employed by Zodiac,in his letters,such as ''fiddle and fart'',indicate that Zodiac may have originated from The Southern States - and Texas,in particular. A possible derivation of Zodiac's adopted introduction : ''This is the Zodiac speaking'',has been suggested as emanating from the BBC's World Radio Service,whose hourly news bulletins always started as follows : ''This is the World Service of the BBC,from London - here is the news,with [newsreader's name] speaking.'' Perhaps Zodiac was an ex-patriot worker [?].A military man or merchant seaman [?].An engineer in the Oil or Construction Industry [?]. A substantial list of inferences and references indicates that Zodiac was an Anglophile.But was he a San Franciscan Anglophile ?Perhaps Zodiac was actually a Briton - and even,more specifically,an Englishman [?]. The whole expression of the phenomenon of Zodiac,represents an abomination.Did this abomination rise from the ''San Fran Bay Area'' ? - or was its seed cultivated in a foreign field,with a ''whirlwind'' harvested on San Francisco's soil [?]. “I have become very upset with the people of San Fran Bay Area. They have not complied with my wishes for them to wear some nice [Zodiac] buttons.” - June 26, 1970 These statements make it seem as if the Zodiac killer was not from the San Francisco Bay Area. However, compare with what the Zodiac killer wrote previously. “What you do not know is whether the death machine is at the sight or whether it is being stored in my basement for future use.” - November 9, 1969 Did that mean that the Zodiac killer was living in a house (with a basement) in the San Francisco Bay Area in 1969?
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Post by Rubislaw32 on Feb 3, 2016 13:38:07 GMT -8
That's an interesting question.The letter November 9th 1969 refers to the death machine as Zodiac's bomb,and in that letter,he goes to great lengths to inform the reader of its ingredients,and how he intends to activate it.
Zodiac makes reference to the ''Killing tools'' - which ''...have been bought through the mail order outfits before the ban went into effect except one and it was bought out of the state.''
When Zodiac wrote that letter,I believe that he assumed at least,that no one was in any doubt that he was a local resident of the San Francisco Bay Area.Whether Zodiac had actually made a bomb or not,should not deter from imparting the ''threat'' - which would have been all the more real,if it was accepted that Zodiac resided nearby. The real impact of the words ''the people of San Fran Bay Area'' is seen as the first real ''giveaway'' that Zodiac was,more than likely,not born and brought up locally.Almost like a foreign spy,passing off as fluent in the ''local lingo'',Zodiac had suddenly let his guard down,by referring to the bay as anything other than ''The Bay Area'' [?].
I believe the significance of this to be that law enforcement could start focusing more on foreigners,ex-patriots,transients etc. as the more likely suspects to fit the ''Zodiac'' perception.
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Post by Rubislaw32 on Feb 5, 2016 9:17:07 GMT -8
To attempt to answer your question,in more specific terms,Ricardo,one needs to home in on accommodation arrangements for Zodiac,when ''doing his thing''.
Whether Zodiac was an ''outsider'' or local,permanent residence would naturally have involved a multitude of possible living arrangements - including of course,a house with basement,that Zodiac inferred was his 1969 position.
With transient workers,it could really depend on their length of stay.Military personnel would usually be housed in barracks,unless of senior rank - who then might be allocated a flat or house.So Zodiac would most likely,have been of senior rank,if in the military.
Merchant seamen would either remain on their vessels,or in a hotel.Travelling salesmen and ''temporary stay'' businessmen,in hotels or guesthouses.
But in Zodiac's 1969 letter,he obviously wanted to,at least,give the impression that his residency was ''stable'',and in close proximity to his deeds [?].
This is why,I personally believe that Zodiac was in either the Construction or Oil Industry - apart from the ''cultural'' inferences made in his letters.It's a lot easier being a more science based person,pretending to be gifted in the Arts - than in the Arts,pretending to be science orientated [?].One simply can't ''wing it''in the sciences,without being exposed readily.
The Oil and Construction Industries,more specifically for those times,offered very lucrative employment packages,since they included the ''hassle money'' factor which was part and parcel of the work involved - i.e. ''On the move'',and often at short notice.
The larger companies had whole departments specializing in accommodation of employees,and education arrangements for worker's children.''Bachelor contracts'' were often seen as no different from ''family employees'' - and single workers were often allocated a temporary house,that would ordinarily be seen as much bigger than necessary.Those two Industries' whole business approach was one of ''necessity at cost'' was cheaper in the long run,than not having,when needed.
So it is possible that Zodiac,as a transient worker and,relatively young man,lived alone in a ''more than adequate'' house,with luxury extras like a basement and double garage.
Zodiac's letters give us an opportunity to extract much more possible information than ''usual'' murder cases.But we can usually only take Zodiac's word for what he claims.
But what worth is Zodiac's word ? That's the real question [?].
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Post by Rubislaw32 on Feb 11, 2016 8:48:11 GMT -8
In examining whether Zodiac was a local or outsider,the tendency is to focus on clues that he was,indeed,an outsider.Effectively,the signs that might indicate that he was not brought up in the ''San Fran Bay Area''.Since Zodiac appeared to know his way around the area,and was an undoubted keen motorist,looking for the ''exceptions'' to the rule of permanent local residence,is the prudent option of investigation.
A case in point,perhaps,could be The Texarkana Moonlight Murders.Between February 22nd 1946 and May 3rd 1946 - a mere few weeks,the West Texas town of Texarkana was terrorized by a serial killer,who claimed eight victims - five of whom were killed.The perpetrator,''armed'' with a motorcar,flashlight and .32 automatic colt pistol,would predominately approach ''lover's lane''couples at night,employing the ruse of intended robbery.Survivors claimed that he wore a white mask,with holes cut out for his mouth and eyes.
Ring any bells ?
As this series of unsolved crimes escalated,the local Newspapers labeled the killer ''The Phantom Killer'' or ''The Phantom Slayer''.
The sheer vastness of the USA,and for those times,meant that most localities would have their ''own'' Bete Noir,but Newspapers as far and wide as Kansas City,New Orleans,Denver and Washington D.C. covered the story.As well as most major towns and cities in Texas.In addition the ''London Times'' in England.
The Texarkana Moonlight Murderer never was apprehended,but given that he was believed to be about thirty years of age,would have been about fifty,if in the unlikely scenario that he went on to become Zodiac.
But,perhaps Zodiac grew up in the wake of the murders that gained folklore status [?].That perhaps,''The Phantom Killer'' inspired ''The Red Phantom'' [?].
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Post by Ricardo on Feb 12, 2016 0:26:36 GMT -8
In examining whether Zodiac was a local or outsider,the tendency is to focus on clues that he was,indeed,an outsider.Effectively,the signs that might indicate that he was not brought up in the ''San Fran Bay Area''.Since Zodiac appeared to know his way around the area,and was an undoubted keen motorist,looking for the ''exceptions'' to the rule of permanent local residence,is the prudent option of investigation. A case in point,perhaps,could be The Texarkana Moonlight Murders.Between February 22nd 1946 and May 3rd 1946 - a mere few weeks,the West Texas town of Texarkana was terrorized by a serial killer,who claimed eight victims - five of whom were killed.The perpetrator,''armed'' with a motorcar,flashlight and .32 automatic colt pistol,would predominately approach ''lover's lane''couples at night,employing the ruse of intended robbery.Survivors claimed that he wore a white mask,with holes cut out for his mouth and eyes. Ring any bells ? As this series of unsolved crimes escalated,the local Newspapers labeled the killer ''The Phantom Killer'' or ''The Phantom Slayer''. The sheer vastness of the USA,and for those times,meant that most localities would have their ''own'' Bete Noir,but Newspapers as far and wide as Kansas City,New Orleans,Denver and Washington D.C. covered the story.As well as most major towns and cities in Texas.In addition the ''London Times'' in England. The Texarkana Moonlight Murderer never was apprehended,but given that he was believed to be about thirty years of age,would have been about fifty,if in the unlikely scenario that he went on to become Zodiac. But,perhaps Zodiac grew up in the wake of the murders that gained folklore status [?].That perhaps,''The Phantom Killer'' inspired ''The Red Phantom'' [?]. The Zodiac killer could have been inspired by the Texarkana Moonlight Murders. Continuing this line of thinking, it suggests that the Zodiac killer might have grown up in an area near Texarkana. Somewhere in Texas? Expressions employed by Zodiac,in his letters,such as ''fiddle and fart'',indicate that Zodiac may have originated from The Southern States - and Texas,in particular. Robert Graysmith mentioned that this phrase was used in Lubbock County, Texas.
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Post by Rubislaw32 on Feb 12, 2016 5:39:51 GMT -8
Indeed Ricardo,Texas,albeit a very large land mass in itself,has been the subject of much speculative interest concerning Zodiac,over the years.The possible ''Phantom'' connection doesn't end with the Texarkana Moonlight Murderer.In addition,the pirate/privateer Jean LaFitte,who in life went under a number of names,was last seen leaving his fortress,La maison rouge,on Galveston Island.Having been forced into exile by The US Govt.,his ghost ''The Phantom Pirate''is often seen around Galveston and The Gulf of Mexico.Texas A&M University finance a society dedicated to the upkeep of Jean Lafitte's memory,who,were it not have been for his brave and selfless acts,would have lost to The British at New Orleans,in The War of Independence.
I shall post in the ''Cipher section'' shortly,with more possible Texas connections....but for now,I would just like to bring the reader's attention to a well known expression that appears in the 408 cipher solution - ''Getting your rocks off''.
''...it is even better than getting your rocks off with a girl...''.So explained Zodiac in comparing the thrilling experience of killing.
''Getting your rocks off''is often referred to as achieving sexual satisfaction - but there are a host of alternative meanings.To ''party'' or rejoice,for instance.Shakespeare's line : ''Lets have another gaudy night'',with ''gaudy'' derived from The Catalan for ''gaudir'',meaning to rejoice.
In 1967,Bob Dylan wrote a song called ''Get your rocks off'',which included the line : ''The man in a Greyhound bus,children outside shouting 'get your rocks off' ''.This meaning referred to a request by the children that the man should unburden his wallet - i.e. give them his money.
The actual derivation of the English Language expression is claimed by Texans,who use ''Get your rocks off'',as well as ''Rock your socks off'',in the context of Ranching.More specifically,the act of taking a ranch horse out for exercise.
So,in theory,the ''408''might have a distinctly Texas connection.
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Post by Rubislaw32 on Feb 13, 2016 14:01:38 GMT -8
In keeping with a possible Texas connection to Zodiac,I should like to take this opportunity to focus readers' attention on the ''408'' cipher solution again.This time,the final 18 alphabetic letters that end the ''408's'' message :
EBEORIETEMETHHPITI
These letters are believed to be an anagram that Zodiac offered up,as a footnote or postscript to an ''already completed'' statement,which ended : ''...collecting of slaves for my afterlife.''
In the ''408'',Zodiac had informed us that he wasn't going to give us his name - so what might this ''postscript'' reveal ?
On the 8th August 1969,The San Francisco Chronicle informed The Vallejo Police that they had received a solution to the ''408'' from The Hardens,and planned to publish it immediately.Just one week after the cipher had been displayed in local SF Newspapers.
Two days later on the 10th August,The Vallejo Police receive their fist two calls regarding The Hardens solution.The second call is from an Academic from Stanford Research Center,who informs The V.P. that the concept of victims becoming slaves of their killers in an afterlife,originates from South East Asia - and,The Philippines in particular.
The first call received,in response to the ''408's'' solution is from a resident of San Francisco.Known only as Robert.H,he believes that the ''postscript anagram'' is : THE TIP I'M ROBERT E EEE.
Well,Robert.H of San Francisco appeared to be in such a hurry to convey his anagram solution,that he suggested that it might denote a surname such as ''Fouries''[!!].Perhaps he later concluded that [bar a possible error from Zodiac],he had actually come up with the distinguished US Military General ROBERT E LEE.
If we home in on General Robert E Lee,what do we find ?
Robert E Lee was born in Virginia,and went on to command the Confederate Army of North Virginia,during the American Civil War.But history teaches us that his ties with Texas were close throughout his life,and in effect,became an adopted son and hero of ''The Lone Star State''.In 1852,Lee became Superintendent at West Point,Fort Worth,Texas,having spent much of his own basic training there.After The Civil War,Lee was appointed a Major General at Fort Mason,Texas.There are statues erected of Lee at The University of Austin,Texas,and Robert E Lee Park,Dallas.In addition,six High Schools in Texas carry his name - and a junior college at Baytown,near Houston.In fact,every year,Texans celebrate Robert E Lee Day,in the third week of January.Indeed,Lee is a true hero of Texas,and symbolizes their Confederacy stance against The Union.
If Robert H of San Francisco - the first person to suggest a credible solution to EBEORIETEMETHHPITI,is correct,then this indicates that Zodiac had some sort of affinity with Robert E Lee.Perhaps Robert E Lee represented Zodiac's ''Alma Mater'' - his predominant education [?].
''The Tip I'm Robert E Eee'' [?].The tip Zodiac was born and raised a Texan [?].
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Post by Ricardo on Feb 15, 2016 23:07:06 GMT -8
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Post by Ricardo on Feb 15, 2016 23:08:53 GMT -8
''...it is even better than getting your rocks off with a girl...''.So explained Zodiac in comparing the thrilling experience of killing. ''Getting your rocks off''is often referred to as achieving sexual satisfaction - but there are a host of alternative meanings.To ''party'' or rejoice,for instance.Shakespeare's line : ''Lets have another gaudy night'',with ''gaudy'' derived from The Catalan for ''gaudir'',meaning to rejoice. According to the Oxford Dictionary of Slang by John Ayto, the idiom “get one’s rocks off” originated in the United States circa 1948. cryptome.org/2013/01/aaron-swartz/019280104X.pdf
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Post by Ricardo on Feb 15, 2016 23:15:10 GMT -8
In keeping with a possible Texas connection to Zodiac,I should like to take this opportunity to focus readers' attention on the ''408'' cipher solution again.This time,the final 18 alphabetic letters that end the ''408's'' message : EBEORIETEMETHHPITI These letters are believed to be an anagram that Zodiac offered up,as a footnote or postscript to an ''already completed'' statement,which ended : ''...collecting of slaves for my afterlife.'' In the ''408'',Zodiac had informed us that he wasn't going to give us his name - so what might this ''postscript'' reveal ? On the 8th August 1969,The San Francisco Chronicle informed The Vallejo Police that they had received a solution to the ''408'' from The Hardens,and planned to publish it immediately.Just one week after the cipher had been displayed in local SF Newspapers. Two days later on the 10th August,The Vallejo Police receive their fist two calls regarding The Hardens solution.The second call is from an Academic from Stanford Research Center,who informs The V.P. that the concept of victims becoming slaves of their killers in an afterlife,originates from South East Asia - and,The Philippines in particular. The first call received,in response to the ''408's'' solution is from a resident of San Francisco.Known only as Robert.H,he believes that the ''postscript anagram'' is : THE TIP I'M ROBERT E EEE. Well,Robert.H of San Francisco appeared to be in such a hurry to convey his anagram solution,that he suggested that it might denote a surname such as ''Fouries''[!!].Perhaps he later concluded that [bar a possible error from Zodiac],he had actually come up with the distinguished US Military General ROBERT E LEE. If we home in on General Robert E Lee,what do we find ? Robert E Lee was born in Virginia,and went on to command the Confederate Army of North Virginia,during the American Civil War.But history teaches us that his ties with Texas were close throughout his life,and in effect,became an adopted son and hero of ''The Lone Star State''.In 1852,Lee became Superintendent at West Point,Fort Worth,Texas,having spent much of his own basic training there.After The Civil War,Lee was appointed a Major General at Fort Mason,Texas.There are statues erected of Lee at The University of Austin,Texas,and Robert E Lee Park,Dallas.In addition,six High Schools in Texas carry his name - and a junior college at Baytown,near Houston.In fact,every year,Texans celebrate Robert E Lee Day,in the third week of January.Indeed,Lee is a true hero of Texas,and symbolizes their Confederacy stance against The Union. If Robert H of San Francisco - the first person to suggest a credible solution to EBEORIETEMETHHPITI,is correct,then this indicates that Zodiac had some sort of affinity with Robert E Lee.Perhaps Robert E Lee represented Zodiac's ''Alma Mater'' - his predominant education [?]. ''The Tip I'm Robert E Eee'' [?].The tip Zodiac was born and raised a Texan [?]. By the way, Robert E. Lee used ciphers in the Civil War. For example, there is an unsolved cipher in a letter dated April 8, 1862, which was sent from General Joseph E. Johnston to General Robert E. Lee. blogs.lib.unc.edu/civilwar/index.php/2012/04/08/8-april-1862/
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Post by Rubislaw32 on Feb 16, 2016 3:10:50 GMT -8
Some fascinating information posted,Ricardo.Just to refer to your questions ''backwards'' :
It just shows how some research can enrich a general debate...I did not realize the cipher connection between senior military personnel,during the American Civil War.If Zodiac was a keen fan of Robert E Lee,he would have known this....inspiration can come from a multitude of sources [?].
It also poses the question whether Zodiac,at any time,was responsible for phone calls made to the police,in the guise of a ''helpful'' citizen [?].Perhaps to either speed up or encourage a particular line of inquiry - or to put the cops off the scent [?].Zodiac certainly enjoyed the limelight,and general ''mischievousness'' may have come in many guises.
While on this subject,who was the ''confidential informant''supplying Lt.Husted with ''information'' on William Grant ? As referred in the Husted Report,this informant could well have been Zodiac,himself [?].Lt.Husted had a reputation for being eccentric [Tarot cards,Ouija Boards,etc.] - but he was certainly not stupid....one does wonder now,if Fed. LE have all of that sussed [?].
It is most interesting that 1948 appears to be the origin of the expression ''Get your rocks off''.At least we know that it pre-dates the era of ''Rock 'n Roll''.''Rock your socks off'' does tend,on first inspection,to suggest ''dancing'' [?].Yes,I believe both expressions are claimed by Texas Ranchers - but as with many expressions,precise ''derivations'' are rarely certain [?].Naturally,one presumes that both expressions are analogous to excessive movement,plus sand and stones,when galloping with a horse [?].
Perhaps a member or guest from Texas might like to contribute to the debate [?].
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Post by Rubislaw32 on Feb 22, 2016 15:48:30 GMT -8
Just to return to a possible solution to the [presumed] anagram as a final line [plus one character] of Zodiac's 408 cipher :
On the morning of August 10th 1969,following that day's publication of The Hardens solution,from The SF Chronicle,the very first call that The Vallejo Police received was from a ''Robert H.'' of San Francisco - suggesting the '' THE TIP I'M ROBERT E EEE ''.
To perhaps ''qualify'' himself,Robert H. further suggested that the ''four E's'' might denote the surname ''Fouries''.This is,as reported by The Vallejo Police.
On a matter of specific accuracy,one can conclude with confidence,that the surname suggestion was actually ''FOURIE'' - not that an uncommon surname.
''FOURIE'' is of Scottish origin,referring to an ancient county in Southern Scotland,now part of the county of Lanarkshire.Through the history of migration,''FOURIE'' is a very common surname in South Africa,and is certainly not ''unheard of'' in North America.
But,the real inference,apart from the accuracy of Robert H.'s anagram suggestion [THE TIP I'M ROBERT E EEE] is :
Was Robert H.'s phone call ''bogus'' ? Was Robert H. ''Zodiac'',calling with a ''red herring'' message - that might have been accurate in one sense - but misleading,in another way [four E's] ??
Note : Robert H. = r h : Red Herring = r h
And of course,the desk top poem found at Riverside was signed '' r h ''.
Perhaps '' r h '' constitutes yet another name that Zodiac employed,that Fed.LE are aware of,at the public's [so far] exclusion [?].
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Post by Rubislaw32 on Mar 4, 2016 17:10:41 GMT -8
To pick up,again,on words or expressions,that might connect Zodiac to a specific nationality - or even a particular area of a country.
The expressions ''fiddle and fart'' [procrastination] and ''getting your rocks off''[sexual satisfaction] have believed,though unconfirmed,origins in Texas,USA,for example.
In a letter to the San Francisco Chronicle [November 9th 1969],Zodiac talked of ''2 cops pulling a goof''.Though ''goof'' has English origins,from ''goff'' meaning ''simpleton'',the actual expression ''pulling a goof'' is U.S slang for making a mistake.
In that same letter,Zodiac referred to ''the cops pulled rubber'',which is U.S slang originating from the sport of ''Drag Racing'',meaning to accelerate in a Drag car,at an exceptional rate.
Again,in that same November 9th letter,Zodiac stated : ''Hey pigs doesn't it rile you up to have yor noze rubed in your booboos ?'' - with ''boo boos'' having U.S origins [circa 1954],based on Baby talk,having various definitions,including excrement.
There are examples where Zodiac employed words,more exclusive to British English - with Kids or Kiddies a case in point.But,the use of American English is so predominant,as to persuade one that Zodiac's origins were predominantly American.Expressions employed such as ''get off your fat asses'',''Do my thing'',and ''Have a blast'' are quintessentially American.''Arses''is more commonly the British English spelling of ''Asses'',anyway.
Even the word ''flashlight'' is rarely used in British English,with ''torch'' the more common term.
Perhaps as a ''proffered summation'',Zodiac was an American Anglophile,with the region of Texas representing his origins......this,with reasonably strong probability.
A ''Hornet's nest'' [?].
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